ForumsQuestionsList is too long
List is too long
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Lise46 |
Please help. I love lists, I love toodledo. I have read and tried to implement GTD. But my toodledo list is way too long and overwhelms me every time I look at it.
This leads to two problems. 1.I don't look at the list as regularly as I need to and miss things that are regular recurring events 2. I fail to enter things that I need to do. I have tried using tags, folders, context - they all feel unnatural to me. Stars are not terrible, but I end up with too many items starred (to try to filter them out) and again, overwhelmed. And priority is the same issue. I was a paper list & calendar girl for years when I was moved to google calendar to better integrate with my husband. But in order to do that effectively, I needed to give up the paper altogether (it was a crutch). So now I am struggling with the lists. Any suggestions? Many thanks! |
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Salgud |
Posted by info_1395434132:
Please help. I love lists, I love toodledo. I have read and tried to implement GTD. But my toodledo list is way too long and overwhelms me every time I look at it. This leads to two problems. 1.I don't look at the list as regularly as I need to and miss things that are regular recurring events 2. I fail to enter things that I need to do. I have tried using tags, folders, context - they all feel unnatural to me. Stars are not terrible, but I end up with too many items starred (to try to filter them out) and again, overwhelmed. And priority is the same issue. I was a paper list & calendar girl for years when I was moved to google calendar to better integrate with my husband. But in order to do that effectively, I needed to give up the paper altogether (it was a crutch). So now I am struggling with the lists. Any suggestions? Many thanks! It sounds like you're a bit overwhelmed by all that TD offers. I would suggest you trim it down, and select just a few basic features to start. Something like Due Date, Priority, Folder, or whatever sounds the best to you for what you're trying to accomplish. Work with these for a week or two, or as long as it takes, then reassess, deciding which to keep, which to remove, and maybe an additional one that sounds like it might help. View it as an experiment - there is no failure as long as you learn from each step. It would probably speed the process to come to these forums at least once a week and review those posts that seem relevant to your efforts. And certainly you want to ask questions as you need to. There are a lot of friendly, knowledgeable people here (I'm one of the mostly friendly ones) who are happy to help. It takes time to learn something entirely new. If you're used to paper task management, switching to electronic is tough at first. You have wisely picked one that can start simple and grow with you as your comprehension of how it works increases, so half the battle is already won! Now just be patient with yourself and learn at your own pace, and before long, you'll be one of the Masters of TD. |
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pawelkaleta |
I fully agree with Salgud.
You may also want to consider some alternative and interesting approach, called 'The One Minute To-Do List' by Michael Linenberger. You will find his free e-book on http://www.michaellinenberger.com, it describes how you could manage your to-do list in more effective way, with strong focus on doing this with the help of Toodledo. You should however keep in mind that it may not solve all of your problems at hand, but may help you to re-think the approach you currently use and apply some adjustments. This message was edited Mar 16, 2016. |
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Ann M |
The issue is not with TD, but in how to create/use your system. TD is flexible enough to take what you did on paper and transfer it electronically. But in all honesty I would suggest you read GTD Getting Things Done as that will help you create/define your structure/system and then the technology becomes agnostic. ~ Ann
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Salgud |
Just a counter point to Frank's suggestion: I have found that after many years of using electronic task managers (Since the early DOS days and Sharp pocket organizers) that, for me, setting artificial due dates only creates more headaches. I spend more time updating fake due dates, often the same ones over and over, than I can afford, and just creates a very high maintenance task management system.
Instead, I've created my own Hotlist (using a Saved Search) to obviate the need for artificial Due Dates. It includes tasks with a Next Action status, regardless of whether they have a Due Date or not.The tricky part is to be able to see those other Active tasks without Due Dates when necessary. So one of the views in my Weekly Review list is "Active, No Due Date" to make sure I review those tasks on a regular basis. With a tool as sophisticated as TD, it takes a while to figure out a system that works for you. In my experience, only the simplest of strategies is accommodated by TD out of the box. For a more sophisticated system, you need to roll your own using Saved Searches, wherein lies the real power of TD that allows you to create a system that truly works for you. I would also caution users about the drawbacks of GTD. While I have blatantly stolen what I think are it's best aspects (which are many), I have avoided what I think is it's weakest points. Primarily, that is Allen's belief that appointments/meetings are not tasks, and are omitted form GTD consideration to be handled some other way. I consider the meetings/appointments I do each day as just as much tasks as the ones with no Due Dates, just a particular kind of task, which have to be accomplished virtually every day, and need to be incorporated into my day as much or more than the tasks do. Many of the tasks I do are in preparation for, or a followup to, one of those meetings that don't exist in GTD. Just a thought. The good news is, whatever way to choose to go, TD can accommodate it, and you can get any needed support from some experienced users in these forums. |
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Purveyor |
Posted by Salgud:
Allen's belief that appointments/meetings are not tasks, and are omitted from GTD consideration to be handled some other way. Where did you get the idea that appointments "are omitted from GTD consideration" and that "meetings don't exist in GTD"?... Many of the tasks I do are in preparation for, or a followup to, one of those meetings that don't exist in GTD. Here's what David Allen says in Getting Things Done, pages 39-41: Calendar
Reminders of actions you need to take fall into two categories: those about things that have to happen on a specific day or time, and those about things that just need to get done as soon as possible. Your calendar handles the first type of reminder. Three things go on your calendar: • time-specific actions; • day-specific actions; and • day-specific information. Time-Specific Actions This is a fancy name for appointments. Often the next action to be taken on a project is attending a meeting that has been set up to discuss it. Simply tracking that on the calendar is sufficient. Day-Specific Actions These are things that you need to do sometime on a certain day, but not necessarily at a specific time. Perhaps you told Mioko you would call her on Friday to check that the report you're sending her is OK. She won't have the report until Thursday, and she's leaving the country on Saturday, so Friday is the time window for taking the action—but anytime Friday will be fine. That should be tracked on the calendar for Friday but not tied to any particular time slot—it should just go on the day. It's useful to have a calendar on which you can note both time-specific and day-specific actions. Day-Specific Information The calendar is also the place to keep track of things you want to know about on specific days—not necessarily actions you'll have to take but rather information that may be useful on a certain date. This might include directions for appointments, activities that other people (family or staff) will be involved in then, or events of interest. It's also helpful to put short-term "tickler" information here, too, such as a reminder to call someone after the day they return from a vacation. ... The "Next Actions" List(s) So where do all your action reminders go? On "Next Actions" lists, which, along with the calendar, are at the heart of daily action-management organization. Any longer-than-two-minute, non-delegatable action you have identified needs to be tracked somewhere. "Call Jim Smith re budget meeting," "Phone Rachel and Laura's moms about sleepaway camp," and "Draft ideas re the annual sales conference" are all the kinds of action reminders that need to be kept in appropriate lists, or buckets, to be assessed as options for what we will do at any point in time. If you have only twenty or thirty of these, it may be fine to keep them all on one list labeled "Next Actions," which you'll review whenever you have any free time. For most of us, however, the number is more likely to be fifty to 150. In that case it makes sense to subdivide your "Next Actions" list into categories, such as "Calls" to make when you're at a phone or "Project Head Questions" to be asked at your weekly briefing. |
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Salgud |
Thanks for your reply, Purveyor. I plead guilty to hyperbole! The part relevant to this discussion is at the beginning:
"Reminders of actions you need to take fall into two categories: those about things that have to happen on a specific day or time, and those about things that just need to get done as soon as possible. Your calendar handles the first type of reminder. Three things go on your calendar: • time-specific actions; • day-specific actions; and • day-specific information" Any time-specific action is on a separate document, the calendar. So you end up with 2 lists, one with non-time specific tasks, one with time-specific tasks. I found I was always trying to juggle the two, because BOTH TAKE TIME. And because of those hybrid tasks, like writing a report. While most of the report can be written at any time, the report is due at a specific time. In my experience, this is awkward in GTD. Meetings are much the same, where a lot has to be done before and after, and can be done any time, but the meeting itself has to occur at a specific time. When you integrate your calendar and your task list, they work together and everything is in one place. The best improvement TD could make is to combine the two, like in Pocket Informant, which is what I use for my personal task list/calendar. I would probably never have used TD if PI had a desktop version at that time. There are other lesser issues I have with GTD, but this was the deal-breaker for me. I'm not saying it's a bad system, only that it's flawed. All systems are to some degree flawed, including mine. I think a big part of choosing a task management system is in deciding which flaws you can live with, and which you can't. As I indicated in my previous post, I borrowed heavily from GTD because it has many great strengths. I just can't work well trying to keep two separate task lists when I don't feel it's necessary. YMMV. This message was edited Mar 22, 2016. |
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totovader |
Posted by info_1395434132:
Please help. I love lists, I love toodledo. I have read and tried to implement GTD. But my toodledo list is way too long and overwhelms me every time I look at it. This leads to two problems. 1.I don't look at the list as regularly as I need to and miss things that are regular recurring events 2. I fail to enter things that I need to do. I have tried using tags, folders, context - they all feel unnatural to me. Stars are not terrible, but I end up with too many items starred (to try to filter them out) and again, overwhelmed. And priority is the same issue. I was a paper list & calendar girl for years when I was moved to google calendar to better integrate with my husband. But in order to do that effectively, I needed to give up the paper altogether (it was a crutch). So now I am struggling with the lists. Any suggestions? Many thanks! I feel your pain. I left Toodledo a few years back because my list was getting too big (close to 8,000 items) and it was causing anxiety and stress. I spent a good couple years switching task / list managers only to come back to Toodledo because I realized the problem was not in what I wanted to do (how big the list was), but in how realistic I was about my time, and how I was able to parse out the list to focus on what was important. I felt relief every time I switched task managers because I was actually cleaning up my list - it became an addiction. Filling out all the information on my tasks in Toodledo was too difficult and I didn't like it back then. I have completely changed my perspective on that: tracking as much as you can for each task helps you parse it out and acts as a test for whether that task is actually worth doing. The key for me in using Toodledo is starting with goals, move to areas of focus (using folders), and then being realistic about how many things I can have queued at any given time. If I have a project planned out, but I'm not going to get to it in the next couple weeks, it's a someday task item. I review those as part of my weekly review and try to commit to moving them to active. If I have something that I just want to get done someday but I haven't sat down and planned it out, it goes in a separate someday list (part of the lists feature). I review those someday lists too, but only move them into actual tasks when I have committed to sitting down and planning them out. I suggest using that list feature to create all kinds of lists: movies to watch, places to visit, things to buy, books to read, gift ideas, etc. No need to clog up tasks for those types of things. The anxiety, I realized, was not from having too much to do - it was from not having focus. It's ok to tell yourself that you will not be able to get to certain things, and then plan out your week according to what is realistic - for me, I try not to have more than 3 main items (must do) and no more than a total of 9 tasks per day; if I'm having a good day, I can always parse through my list and knock some more stuff out based on context. Also, don't knock paper and pen. When I plan out my day (the night before), I review my next actions and top priority items and star those (meaning, I'm going to do these tomorrow). I then write down that list in a daily quasi-bullet journal. This keeps me from spending time procrastinating throughout my day playing around with my Toodledo lists, and it also keeps the anxiety low because I'm not looking at a giant list that really doesn't even apply in my current context. Additionally, habits can be your friend. I found that I was putting a lot of tasks repeating daily that - when I thought about it - were really just habits I wanted to fit into my daily routine. When I moved them into the habits feature, something magical happened: I was able to quickly see the progress of influencing positive habits, instead of stressing about checking off that daily task. It flips it around so it's a positive experience instead of a stressful one - and once a chain is completed, I personally don't think you need to track the habit anymore. That said, I would also recommend keeping your habits to a reasonable number - and forgiving yourself if you break the chain. Keep in mind, your system should be what works for you - and it may take time to become comfortable. Many people go through this journey and experience anxiety and frustration along the way. No tool solves for that. However, I believe that Toodledo is the best tool to allow you to manage your list the most effectively because it includes an array of tools to help you be as effective as you want to be. Other tools simply don't allow that functionality. Also, try to keep in mind that you are already miles ahead of everyone else - having a giant list on paper or in your task manager means it's not in your head. That's a massive step forward - now you can look at it, decide what you want to do about those things, and use your brain power to be creative about those projects, tasks, and goals. It doesn't mean you need to actually do all those tasks. |
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Purveyor |
Two good articles by David Allen:
Let the lists fall where they may Probably the most universal how-to question for GTD neophytes is this: How do I keep track of all the things that you're recommending I keep out of my head? What's the best tool? The answer is pretty simple: however you most effectively can create and review lists. The subtlety of streamliningMany of the tools for personal organization miss the mark because they try too hard to simplify the complexity of our lives into forms and features. They often make our attempts at organization more difficult.
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Salgud |
I try to apply this rule to everything I do, including task management:
"Perfection is finally attained not when there is no longer anything to add, but when there is no longer anything to take away ..." Antoine de Saint Exupery I think Allen gets this. |
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Lise46 |
My apologies for the delayed response - managed to get a vacation at the end of March and I am just caught up enough on the criticals to cruise over here. I haven't even begun to re-review the list. And thanks to everyone for replying.... each answer helped me move forward.
Salgud - thanks for suggesting that appointments make sense on the daily. That has been a point of frustration for me (missing or being late to something because I'm focused on the to-do and miss the to-go-to). I think if I keep future appointments on the calendar and during the next day review add the relevant calendar items to the to-do (with times) that might help. (Or reverse that, but the daily calendar is a color-coded thing of beauty with work, family and kids. More would probably be noise) DrFrankBuck - thanks for the dating idea. Sort of like a tickler file on the desk, but more insistent. (Those were NOT my friend). Also using the quick search. I find the saved searches to be over-whelming, but a simpler one could work well. Purveyor - great links, thank you. Added to the list (smile). Actually, I am going to endeavor to read them tonight, or I will add them to my link list (not the to-dos) that I do bounce into. I appreciate it. totovader - you gave me an ah-ha moment. I see that several of the items on my list are design related. Design this basket, design that basket. I should move those to a list and just keep a single "design new basket" on the list as a recurring event. Ditto for items to upload to the website and books/web blogs to read. I do keep a 'to read' list (in excel actually, because it has multiple tabs) - I need to regularly move the titles here to that list and then delete away. add these. I also need to be aware that things are falling to the bottom of my list because they are added from my phone and I am not grabbing a folder or due date for them. Ann - part of my challenge IS GTD. I've read the book, at least twice, and follow his blog. But brain dumping everything has led to not having an effective working list. And keeping separate list (working and everything else) was even worse - because deciding what was where was drowning me. Now I am in the weird position of brain dumping (good, out of the brain) and trying to prioritize, and getting completely bogged. Still working on it, but maybe it is time to go back into the book again to clean up implementation errors! A phrase I heard in a training session recently "Progress not Perfection". I think that is right. Or maybe for the perfectionist in me: Progress IS Perfection. Thanks to everyone for your time and wisdom. I do appreciate it very much. Lise This message was edited Apr 07, 2016. |
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